Ireti Kingibe is the senator representing Federal Capital Territory (FCT) at the National Assembly. In this interview, she speaks on her disagreement with the Minister of the FCT, Nyesom Wike, and her defection to the African Democratic Congress (ADC), among other issues, ANAYO EZUGWU writes

What is your reaction to the demise of President Muhammadu Buhari?

I would like to condole with his family, the nation, the FCT, and even myself because I knew him well. I have always been on the same side. I campaigned with him in 2003, and most of the time, I’ve been on Buhari’s side, even when I was not in his party. In 2014-2015, I was in his personal entourage and campaigned with him to become president. We have lost a president. In his earlier days, he used to be quite passionate. I think a little bit of that was lost later on. I mean, we all lose our passions from time to time and may his soul rest in peace.

What exactly is at the heart of the conflict that has been brewing between yourself and Nyesom Wike?

The primary thing is that the minister doesn’t obey the rule of law. He’s autocratic. He doesn’t follow any rules or any laws, and when you try to draw his attention that governance is based on laws and rule of law, he doesn’t accept that.

The truth is that Abuja does not have as many enabling laws as most states. And when I tried to talk to other ministers, they said ‘the truth of the matter is that’s how it is. But whether we liked the National Assembly members elected by the people of the FCT or not, we worked with them.

‘We sat with them monthly, and they tabled the issues of the people to us and we also tabled our legislative issues to them. When we needed laws urgently, it was up to them to make the National Assembly pass them.’ For instance, the Federal Capital Development Authority (FCDA, when it was created, got rid of FCT, which was a ministry, permanent secretary and all. Minister Wike has brought them all back without the enabling laws.

I mean, if he wants these things, he should ask the National Assembly to create the enabling laws but he doesn’t because he’s just autocratic. He feels he can do anything, and of course, my job is to oversight. I remember that when Nasir El-Rufai was minister, he was having this back and forth with the senator.

Why? He put an educational levy on schools for N3,000 and the senator refused but after a while, El-Rufai took it off, because it wasn’t worth the harangue because most ministers like a smooth working relationship with the senator and member of House of Representatives.

If I we are making a list of all the things that President Tinubu has done wrong… and which has de-marketed him the most, has been Minister Wike because FCT is a mini-Nigeria

And even things that are no-brainers that are obvious, for instance, Abuja University, which had approximately 11,000 hectares. Minister Wike has revoked 7,000 of it and left them with four.

It is definitely against the Land Use Act for you to take land from institutions to give them to individuals.

A lot of the things that I bring up in public about what Minister Wike can do or not do would have been best discussed privately. I can say no, you can’t do it and after a while, he will understand it. But as far as he’s concerned, nobody should speak in the FCT and that’s not so. So, he doesn’t leave me much choice, but for all these things to be discussed public.

You were elected by the people as opposed to him who is appointed by the president. So, you are the one that people know and it is to you that they come to complain. What do they say to you about Wike?

Mostly, the average person does not have access to him. But usually, when the minister does something and they’re offended, they bring it to me.

For instance, every minister has come and found the streets being cleaned by indigent women. Even when some ministers come and want to bring mechanical street sweepers, we said no, this is a source of livelihood for our indigent women, widows and other underprivileged women, and they let it be.

Now, this particular minister has come and he fired all of them regardless of what anybody has said. Then he didn’t replace them with mechanical street sweepers. So, Abuja is looking dirty. People will grumble, but it is not my job to grumble. It is my job to oversight him and say this is not right.

You cannot do this. People are not paid and I’ve tabled that as a public complaint. They didn’t think it was a problem because government is a continuum. He says, no, he’s not paying them. He didn’t give them the job. Two years on, they haven’t been paid and that’s how he’s been governing us. The pity of it is that he doesn’t have executive powers. He derives his powers from the President.

There is a street poll in Abuja recently and many ordinary people said they would vote for Wike if he run for president based simply on the things that he’s done in Abuja. How much is that reality likely to send a message to Wike to continue?

You’re talking about that poll; who conducted the poll and how was it conducted. I’m not knocking it but I am saying that local government elections are coming in a few months and it is usually from local government that we know how the people feel about ministers of the FCT.

When we come to any kind of election, can he tell the people go and do this and they do it? If he can’t, then it means that all that he has been doing is blustering and carrying on and just making noise.

When you watch the way Wike has managed to use his flair to get to President Tinubu, how do you analyse how he has managed to draw the line between being a member of the Peoples Democratic Party (PDP) and still be a great influence on the president, possibly the greatest influence of all the ministers in that cabinet?

Well, it’s my personal opinion that it is rather unfortunate because if I we are making a list of all the things that President Tinubu has done wrong, the greatest wrong he has done to himself, and which has demarketed him the most, has been Minister Wike because FCT is a mini-Nigeria.

Even people who vote in other places, they live here or they come and go. And when you watch the impunity, it doesn’t speak, it doesn’t settle this government. The truth as I say, the people of FCT from the beginning were not really hostile to president because we’re not that way inclined. We’re not focused on parties. We focus on actions and how did you govern us?

But Wike symbolizes, how do I put this diplomatically? We have been, okay, let me give you an example of people you expect to vote for you. In Bwari, there’s a land allocated for a government general hospital. Minister Wike revokes it and he’s having some sort of a market or mall or something put on it. Now, how do you think people will feel who expect that?

At the very least, maybe you’ll try and build that general hospital, not take it and give it to your crony. And all these things are documented. They are not done in a hidden manner. It’s all open and you can do your worst. Minister Wike has been harassing all of FCT over ground rent. In fact, he’s not giving any time. If you don’t pay, he will revoke your house. It varies from people to people, including embassies.

Now, I have documents, and if this Minister Wike is so popular, how come it’s so easy to get secret documents of everything that’s going on within the FCDA? I have documents to show that when Minister Wike allocated land to his sons, huge tracts of land. Fine, as he says, though they’re his sons, they’re entitled to land. No problem.

But the bills, I have them documented, of N200 million that you need to pay, N100 million here that you need to pay. They wrote to him asking that the bill, he should give a waiver, reduce it. Within 48 hours, they’re going from N200 million to N22 million. Of course it’s illegal. At the very least, it’s unfair and it’s unethical at the very least.

And these things, I am a civil engineer, I’m a fact person. I wouldn’t say so publicly, without having the facts and the documentation. So, in that regard, should he be afraid of you because you’ve got oversight over him, or are you afraid of him? I’m definitely not afraid of him. I’m not saying he should be afraid of me. I’m just saying that, considering he should be aware that most things he does, I will know.

You have defected from Labour Party to the ADC, isn’t it?

Well, I will defect, but I haven’t officially done so yet.

But have you left the Labour Party?

You all seem to forget that for some months now I have been party-less. If I go by a sub-faction of Labour Party that says they’ve suspended me, but since there are two factions, our faction has also said we’ve suspended and expelled the other factions. There are two clear factions of Labour Party, an untenable situation for any person seeking political office. So, obviously, I will defect, but I would like to do so with other senators who are elected on the platform of the party.

But your direction is the ADC?

Definitely, but it’s an evolving movement. For me, more urgently, I needed my aspirants in the FCT to have a party. We are going to area council elections and the Labour Party aspirants should not be in two different factions. So, right now, we have all aspirants taking cards in ADC, and also, we have a huge influx of FCT politicians joining the ADC. So, we are preparing and gearing up for a major battle with APC come 2026.