Senator Ali Ndume represents Borno South Senatorial District at the National Assembly. In this interview, he speaks on resurgence of insecurity across Nigeria, economic mismanagement and President Bola Tinubu’s lopsided appointments, among other issues, ANAYO EZUGWU writes

You described President Bola Tinubu’s appointments as a very big infraction on the federal character constitutional provisions and that more than 70 per cent of his appointees are from his South-West zone, tell us more. About that?

You have said it all. I don’t think I have anything more to add than to say the figures are there and you can look at the figures. It’s not that I’m just making accusations.

And it’s not that I’m saying, well, the President has no right to do that kind of thing. There’s a constitutional provision. Section 14.3 of the constitution is very clear.

When you look at it vis-avis the appointments made so far, and they are political appointments, if you have professional appointments, so to say, you can’t appoint somebody who is not a soldier to become the Chief of Army Staff, or you can’t appoint somebody that is not a policeman to be the IG of Police, and you can’t appoint such persons once they are not qualified. But then when you come to look at political appointments, the constitution is very clear.

And it is to avoid such infractions that the constitution in section 14.3 clearly states that appointments, especially political appointments, should reflect the federal character but that is not the case here.

And all I’m saying is to call the attention of Mr. President to such infractions, so that they can be corrected otherwise these things can boomerang at a certain period. I know, as you rightly said, people look at me as somebody critical of the government.

I have the right to do that in the first place. And in fact, that’s why I’m in the National Assembly in the first place. Collectively, we are supposed to oversight the acts of Mr. President and point out some of these irregularities. That is what we swore to do.

It’s not personal. I think I have a better personal relationship with most of these people who are talking about Tinubu. And I can say that in the North, if you count up to five people who have close relationship with Mr. President, Ndume is one of them.

The coming of President Tinubu is based on justice, equity and fairness and it is expected that he will continue in that direction to ensure fairness

But that does not stop me from speaking the truth and have an obligation to do that, especially when all of us know that at the end of it all, each one of us will stand before God and God will ask him to account for what he is responsible for.

That’s why I’m saying this. Besides, we are all in this government. What will we tell our people? We have these figure; it’s already viral. It’s already in circulation.

But you know what? From now on, after this interview, those attack dogs will start attacking Ndume, not the message. And that’s why we always get it right. It is not about Ndume or me being a senator. As a Nigerian, I have the right to voice out all this. It’s not only that; I have the right to even protest.

That is guaranteed by the constitution. But from tomorrow, those so-called Tinubu boys or people will start attacking Ndume. They will say ‘he’s a frustrated person’ but the facts are there. I’m not the one that created it. These are facts extracted from what is going on there.

Is it the generality of his appointments or is it the more sort of juicier jobs?

No. It’s not about juicier jobs. It’s about spread. It’s about equity. It’s about justice. And look, the coming of President Tinubu is based on justice, equity and fairness and it is expected that he will continue in that direction to ensure fairness and he swore as a president to be fair, equitable, and just.

That is what the president swore to be. But that is not what is being reflected in the events, whether he knows it or he doesn’t know. That’s why I called on his attention to look at these things, so that he can do something about it.

That is the issue and now I’m also begging or calling those attack dogs out there to please address the issue rather than Senator Ndume, address the message. I know that those attack dogs cannot defend the President when the chips are down.

Why am I saying when the chips are down? Most of them, go and check them, I did my research too, I’ll come up with the figures, almost 60 or 70 per cent of them are half Nigerians. Do you know why? Most of the appointees, you check around, and I’ll come up with the figures.

Most of them are people who have dual citizenship. I’m not saying it’s illegal, but all I’m saying is those types of people cannot give the country 100 per cent because they are not 100 per cent Nigerians.

The real issue here is whether there is an infraction on the federal character constitutional provisions of this country. Should it matter where people come from as long as they capable in the job that they are chosen to do?

I support the president getting, even if it is an expatriate, to occupy a certain position as long as it doesn’t infract the constitution. But what he is doing now infracts the constitution.

And worst of it, so far, not all, the majority of those that are given those responsibilities are not discharging their so-called responsibilities because we haven’t gotten to where we will say there is hope in the country under the leadership of those people.

All we hear is endure; it will be okay and it’s two years. But the main purpose of government is clearly stated in section 14 of the Constitution, security, welfare of its citizens and, of course, other things that follow in section 14 of our Constitution. We are far from most of them, especially the issue of security and welfare of citizens.

You’ve been raising the alarm, not only over the killings in Uromi, in Edo State, and the massacre in Plateau State, but you’ve also expressed grave concern over the escalating militant attacks in your home state of Borno, and what appears to be the resurgence of Boko Haram and ISWAP there. Just briefly tell us about your concerns…

Just recently a captain and corporal were killed and a corporal in my local government. They have a platoon there and they have a battalion nearby.

The Boko Haram came, killed the captain, and tried to, but for the resilience of the people and the soldiers there, we lost two. In Goshe, a local government, in another village, in the last five days or so, Boko Haram attacked them and killed three soldiers.

Recently, in Wajiroko, Damboa Local Government Area, there is what they call Front Operation Base (FOB), which was attacked and we lost four soldiers. The story is the same n other area. In Kebbi, there was a case of Lakurawa killing about 12 people or so.

There’s this killing in Plateau again. That of Indigenous People of Biafra (IPOB) is isolated killings in the SouthEast, but still going on. You can see that Nigeria’s security challenge is still there. When it goes down a little bit, it goes up again. And as I said, the main purpose of government is security. As it is now, you can’t go anywhere in Borno.

You can’t travel anywhere after five in the evening till eight in the morning and it has been like that. But the only difference is that before now, even after eight o’clock in the morning, you cannot travel freely without escort. But these days, there is an improvement that you can go some routes without escort.

But as I’m telling you now, some of the routes, especially from Maiduguri to Damboa that you can reach in two hours, you have to at least travel eight hours.

That road that we used to take under escort; that is from Maiduguri to Damboa is completely closed now because we have been losing lives there coupled with the fact that even the citizens are complacent. The security challenge is so much and we have been losing soldiers as well as people.

Why do you think things have gotten worse?

It’s not that things have gotten worse, but they still are lingering. You can see, there’s a kind of stalemate. The Nigerian Army is doing its best under the circumstances that they are operating as I’m talking to you now.

I don’t know about last week. I don’t know about last month. Our soldiers who sacrificed their lives, some of them are yet to be even paid the N70,000 minimum wage. And their daily allowance up till now.

I’m a Nigerian, I’m a senator, it’s N1,500. You can imagine what N1,500 can do to somebody that you just post from Port Harcourt. I met a young man from Bayelsa State, posted to Bama, and he’s been paid N50,000 when I met him.

Committee on the Army, didn’t you have oversight capacity at that time?

I’m not trying to exonerate myself because we didn’t get there anyway. But President Muhammadu Buhari is still alive. He knew the pressure I put on him, especially for him to approve the loan that we collected to procure the Tucano jets. But right now, the truth of the matter is that our armed forces generally are not well trained, they are not equipped, are not motivated, and they are not armed.

If you don’t do that, you don’t get anywhere. I suggested at one time that if we can’t do that in the shortest possible time, then one of the short-term solutions that the Chief of Defence Staff came here to disagree with me, which he’s entitled to, is to engage the service of Private Military Contractors (PMC).

It’s done all over. America, which is the greatest country in the world, engaged Blackwater, which is their known contractor. The British Army does that. France does that. So, with this, the problem that can be solved. And, it’s in three or four or five black spots, you can address it by engaging the PMCs and asking them to fix it.

They’ll fix it and the Nigerian Army can engage itself in other things. General Christopher Musa is my friend and we worked closely when I was chairman of Senate Committee on the Army. He is a very good guy and he’s very intelligent. But they are deprived. I look at his position as a kind of pride because what’s wrong with engaging private contractors to solve the problem?

You raised concern over the high borrowing by the government; how serious a situation does this look like from your point of view as a senator and how much of a national crisis is it?

Let me first of all say that I’m not against borrowing. Even the greatest countries in the world; America, Japan and China, are big borrowers. But they borrow for physical, tangible and accountable projects that you spread and pay over time.

But my worry is not even with the borrowing, it’s what you borrow for. Let me give you quickly a rundown of what I checked. In June 2023, $500 million was borrowed for a women’s programme to scale up what they call MPWPS. Can you see that? Can Nigerians see it? Where are the women?

All these people shouting about 2027, they don’t believe in God because 2027 is two years ahead, and we don’t know who is going to be alive then

Then on June 23, the same day, $800 million was borrowed to cushion the impact of high petrol prices after fuel subsidy removal.

On September 23, 2023, under the same government, $700 million was borrowed for adolescent girls initiated for learning and empowerment. On December 23, 2023, $750 million was borrowed through what they call renewable energy scale-up.

Then June 24, 2024, $1.5 billion was borrowed to support Nigeria’s reform for economic stabilization to enable transformation.

Then on June 24 2024, $750 million again was borrowed for immediate financial and technical support for efforts to stabilize the economy and to scale up support to the poor and most economically at risk. Look, whenever you’re doing something, if it is true, somebody will come out to say thank you.

Were these loans approved by the National Assembly?

All of these didn’t pass through the Senate. The medium-term expenditure framework is something that they bring and we look at and maybe approve it, but that is not to say it’s blank.

So far, these items bypassed the National Assembly. Before you pass the budget annually, there is an expenditure framework that must come before the National Assembly for approval.

These are the things that the government is anticipating to spend, but that is not to say that even if it is approved, it is a blanket approval. Every item must be accounted for because you need to ask questions. How are you going to do that? How is it important? And where is the money? What are the terms?

All these things are supposed to be discussed first before you engage in it. That is the National Assembly approval. But as I said, when you total these borrowings, the figure I got here is about $9.45 billion, which translates to about N13 trillion.

And as I said, I mentioned most of them. These are items that are either intangible. These items have nothing to do with infrastructure. I would have supported, for example, that the country is borrowing even more than that to build our infrastructure, to build railways, to build our roads.

These things that I’m mentioning are not tangible things that you can hold on to. And these are things that you pay in the next 40 or 50 years. That time we are gone and are we going to tell our children or grandchildren that we borrowed $700 million and we’re paying in 20, 30 years for Adolescent Girls Initiative.

Nigeria, fortunately, has enough human capital that we need to tap into. Remember, you not only don’t provide service in Nigeria but you also to others outside the country. We have the human capital or human resources, so to speak. It’s just to harness it.

Do you believe that you are acting by your best principles as a senator and a member of the ruling party by these whistleblowing actions that you’re taking and that you are preserving the rule of law in Nigeria?

Let me correct that. I’m a bona fide member of the All Progressives Congress (APC); one of those that signed onto the initial formation of APC. And Nigeria is my country, and as I said, I don’t have any other country.

Does all this play into 2027?

I hear them talking about 2027 all the time, but for me, I’m not. I’m talking about today and at most tomorrow. I’m 65. I thank God for my life.

All these people shouting about 2027, they don’t believe in God because 2027 is two years ahead, and we don’t know who is going to be alive then. We have not finished with the mandate. We are just two years old. In fact, until next month, the President is not two years old and you are talking about 2027.

By the time the president is performing very well and Nigerians are happy, nobody will come and start talking about competing with Mr President. It will be automatic.

But as it is now, they keep on talking nonsense as far as I’m concerned, because as I said, three things will determine whether this government is going to succeed or not.

One is security. Two is the welfare of its citizens. And three that is related to welfare is the economy itself. If it is not performing, then you can go and be talking nonsense. It will not work.

Why does it appear to be only you out of the many senators in the National Assembly, including members of the opposition, who draws attention to these alleged excesses? Does that suggest that all the others are complicit in these violations?

No, that is not! I’m Mohammed Ali Ndume. God created me differently. And I’m going to account for my actions. If everything is to go the way I want, there would have been only one person in the Senate and that’s me.

But that is not. We have 109 of us, different senatorial districts and different makeup. God does not create two persons at a time. So, I cannot say about my colleagues but let me tell you, I have the support of the people, including my colleagues.

The only difference is that they can’t come out and take the bullet the way I do. Not that they don’t have the guts but they are always thinking that something will come but not me.